EfI Bonnie hard to start

N

nzkiwi

Scooter
I've got a 2011 EFI SE Bonnie traveled 6,000km. Since new and every so often if just doesn't want to start. The dealer has had a look for the problem and hasn't been able to trace the fault. Last time they suggested it could be the battery, so I changed the battery, cleaned the contacts and nothing changed.
The fault is every so often when I go to start, the starter motor kicks in, then kicks out straight away without turning the motor. This will repeat time and time again. To make the starter work properly,the weird solutions are either a twist on the throttle, or beeping the horn, or flashing the lights. This is indicating it required a voltage change to reset something.
Has anyone else experienced this? and any ideas or thoughts appreciated.
 
H

henrys

Street Tracker
Start with the obvious. Check the electrical connections between the battery and the starter solenoid as well as the starter relay and the starter switch. Maybe there is a loose connection somewhere or corrosion? The starter circuit is really simple on this bike. There should be a wiring diagram out there.
 
D

drlapo

Hooligan
loose or corroded connecter is the frist thing to look for
take the entire circuit apart, clean and grease all connetions
I had a similar problem with my BMW and it was a corroded contact on the starter motor
 
N

nzkiwi

Scooter
Thanks for your feed back. By the way it behaves I'm erring towards thinking it is low voltage on the ECU. This helps explain why it is random, more likely to occur in the morning and why the strange fix works. The strange fix is as I mentioned is to open the throttle a little to get the starter motor to engage. I'll pass your information onto the dealer and hopefully a cure can be found.
 
D

dexxter

Scooter
Same intermittent problem here, on my 20ll Bonnie. For about 1 out of every 10 starts, it will take 2, 3, or 4 tries. If I keep the starter button pushed, it will attempt to start by itself every 2 seconds. The dealer checked "everything," replaced the starter solenoid and starter motor, and checked the starter relay. I replaced the battery (which seemed fine) with a Shorai lithium-ion; no difference. It appears to be a problem I - and quite a few others at triumphrat.net - will have to just live with.
 
N

nzkiwi

Scooter
Sounds exactly like the problem I'm having. I found the best way to get the starter motor to kick in after the first failed attempt is a gentle twist on the throttle. Have you tried that? and does it cure the problem you are having?
 
R

rogersbm

Scooter
Try the choke

I have this problem occasionally on my 2010 SE. If you pull the 'choke' out to the first notch, it starts every time. It's worth a try! Let us know if this works.
 
N

nzkiwi

Scooter
Took my Bonnie back to the dealer today. They have seen this fault before in a number of bikes. Basically it is a battery problem. With normal batteries, as you start the motor, added to the drain by the fuel injection and other electrical items, the voltage drops below the minimum voltage and the starter cuts out. With carb Bonnies this isn't a issue. Seems all batteries aren't created equal and some have better resilience to voltage drop to others. Or you get what you pay for. Currently my Bonnie is starting very regular on the second attempt. As it has never not started, I'll stick to my current battery for at least another year.

.
 
Demar

Demar

Two Stroke
After I removed the air injection my T100 would not start easily when cold. If I pull out the choke it starts right away. With the choke in, it would try to start but not kick over. Now I pull the choke all the way out and start it and leave the choke out for about 30 seconds, then I push the choke in one notch for another 30 seconds. If I pulled into a gas station it would start with the choke in if I didn't wait too long. After it cooled a bit, say, 20 minutes, I would need to pull out the choke until it started then push the choke in. Lately, I've been able to start it without the choke after it's warm. This is a 2010 T100 I bought new in June of 2011. Prior to removing the air injection it would always start easily with the choke in. I never used the choke initially.
 
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R

rogersbm

Scooter
Ditto!

Demar, you describe exactly what my 2010 SE does (use of choke, petrol stop, etc) but I haven't yet removed my AI! Who knows? As long as it goes (and it goes well), it's not really a major drama. I've got the bike booked in for its 24 month service in early Feb, so I'll ask the mechanic what he thinks.
 
D

dexxter

Scooter
You are now discussing a different problem than what was originally introduced by the first poster. The problem was/is an intermittent electrical glitch, and definitely NOT a fuel problem: For every 5th - 10th start, if the starter button is left pushed-in, the starter will repeatedly re-try to start every 2 seconds. While it usually starts on the second attempt, the starter sometimes re-tries a third, fourth, or even fifth time, before successfully turning over and starting. When someone finally figures this out, please let us know.
 
ralfy

ralfy

moped
optima

For my part I have the same problem on my 2011 bonnie equipped with alarm what matters worse, I hold the load with optimum charger because the battery has a low amperage and charging the update of what is seen tuneecu 20660 stock.
 
D

dexxter

Scooter
It's not a battery problem. I replaced my original battery with a Shorai lithium-ion unit, and the intermittent starting problem still exists. The Triumph dealer now says, "They all do it," and says I should write to Triumph USA to complain (I've contacted them before). Yep, great customer service. Buyer beware.
 
N

nzkiwi

Scooter
I've been trying the quick start method, and so far it has always started first go. Someone else on the web suggested it. Basically I hit the starter button the moment the tach and speedo needles hit the max of their start up sweep. This is well before the EFI has finished priming. I suspect it works is there isn't enough time to either drain the battery or the control system to realize the battery has dropped in volts.
 
D

dexxter

Scooter
Thanks, NZ-Kiwi. 'Not much decent riding weather lately, up here in northwest Washington state, but I will begin to use your procedure and hope for this to be the cure. After more than 1 1/2 years of this problem (since day-one of ownership), my local dealer, now, not only says, "They all do it," but adds that I'm "too picky." Unbelievable. I'm hoping your idea will finally give me reliable, consistent ignition. I'll let you know.
 
D

dexxter

Scooter
Thanks for your link, Ralfy, but my headlight already cuts out - automatically - when I hit the start button. I've also replaced the stock battery with a lithium-ion unit that meticulously maintains its charge. Next step: hitting the start button as the gauge needles hit their maximum sweep with ignition turned on.
 
LoVel

LoVel

Two Stroke
I have sent Triumph USA a letter about the ECU problem and received no response to present. This doesn't surprise me. Triumph USA sucks at customer service. They would rather go to court than fix a fuck up. :finger:
 
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